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Audio recording of the interview with Matthew Feldman


NARRATOR: Senator Matthew Feldman
INTERVIEWER: Jund Kapell
DATE OF INTERVIEW:    November 4, 1985
TRANSCRIBER: Jackie Kinney (12/85)

(i) Matty, as everyone calls you, the usual question we ask is, why did you come to Teaneck and when?

(N) June, we moved here Muriel and I in 1948, it was in February. Right after that great blizzard of 47. We moved to Teaneck very honestly there was no housing in Jersey City. Got out of the service and lived in Jersey City for a year and a half and we were looking for homes and/or for apartments. Non were available. The Veterans barracks didn’t interest me. They were renovated into affordable housing. I lived with my folks and we have two little girls, one born on the Army time, well two were born on the Army time and then we looked. We were looking for a home and we looked up in the Oranges because my brother lived in South Orange. Would you believe it, prices in those years are prohibitive at the Oranges and Bergen County was one, that was one of the motivating forces that brought us to Bergen because homes were less costly than they were in Essex County. And we fell in love with Teaneck after looking at various towns in Bergen County and the magnet that brought us to Teaneck was number one, the school system, the cultural life of the community, and the type of government whish was council/manager government. Being born and raised in Jersey City and no matter where I went through my Army years, I sort of was taunted, Mayor Haig, jersey City, big City politics and it is refreshing knowing that the type of government that we had here was free of that boss control that I experience growing up in Jersey City. Schools were second to none. They were, everybody envied the school system. The pleasantness of the community. The very fine and excellent police and fire department, they were professionals. And we selected a little Dutch Colonial home on Cherry Lane.

(I) How soon after you got here did you start becoming active in local affairs?

(N) Well I became involved first in the Jewish community of Teaneck. Originally there were about 200 families in those years. And then I was appointed because of my physical ed background, I was appointed to the Advisory Board on Parks and Recreation. And I guess with a great deal of pride, immeasurable pride, just was a participant, not a spectator.

(I) You had always planned on politics as a career?

(N) No, it was the farthest thing from my mind. Of course, they say if you can survive in synagogue politics, you can survive anyplace. But I became involved in the Teaneck Jewish, in those years, Teaneck Jewish Community Center. Now the Teaneck Jewish Center. And I took a great deal of satisfaction being part of the growth and development of the center, its new building and then getting involved in the community was just an extension of my community life.

(I) Well what was your first activity? You mentioned the Advisory Board

(N) Park and Recreation where I met people like George Larsen and Dick Rodda and I just contributed whatever talent, my talents to Park and Recreation and then (gap in tape)

(I) So after Park and Recreation …

(N) As I think back, not as the dry bones of the dead past but as we are talking, this panorama comes alive and I was friendly with the then councilman in the community, Al Robison, who was subjected at that time to, well I wouldn’t call it political opposition but Al and Anne Robison, Al in particular though he was Republican, this town was controlled by the Teaneck Taxpayers League. All Robison was part of that and the community was well run. Paul Volcker who was the manager followed by Jim Welsh but Al happened to be a progressive Republican and the mayor in those years, Mayor T. J. E. Brown, objected to Al running as a delegate to the Republican National Convention representing the Republican party of Bergen County because he felt that Al Robison was to liberal and because Al gave to causes and to candidates sometimes who were no Republic in other parts of the country and they felt, I remember … Robison is not my type of Republican. I had a great deal of respect for Al Robison in those years as I do now. The respect has grown even more. And I was very hurt by the criticism leveled against Al Robison and I was determined to get involved in politics, in the election, to see to it that Al Robison would be reelected to the township council and I discussed that with Al hoping that we would make him one of the top go-getters in the community and I had a talk with Al and Al said to me, I’ve had it. It is up to young people like you to get involved. So that ended, well Al Robison did go, he did win, he was a delegate to the convention. It was during the Eisenhower years and Al made up his mind not to run for council anymore and we were sitting around one evening, I believe it  was Teddy Ley was one of the people involved and we were sort of promoting the Robison incident because he had a lot of respect from those of us who knew his in the community and somebody should run representing a progressive point of view and before I know it, there were petitions and I just fell into it. Nothing predetermined. It was the farthest thing, June, from my mind when I moved here to get involved in politics. I was busy making a living. I had two lovely little daughters. Then Mariel was pregnant in 49 with Danny and I had no, really, I was happy doing as a father, I has happy doing my thing in the community whether it be Community Chest, whether getting involved in the school referendum in those years, the junior highs. I just wanted to be a good citizen in the community and I fell into this. I really fell into it and that’s the beginning.

(I) And were you elected in that first council race?

(N) Well we, I have to give credit to a Stewart Brown. Stewart Brown lived on Ramapo Road. I met him through some Veteran groups. Stu and I became very firm and fast friends. And Stewart was my first campaign manager and he set up, it was a coalition with Milton Votee from the Taxpayers League, a man in his 70’s in those years, who we have a park named after. The park was named for him when he was able to witness the naming of that park, Augie, Han, Hannibull and myself, we were called the “4, 9, 10” and this was back in 1958 I believe. Hannibull I think was 4, Feldman was 9, Votee 10 on the ballot. And we ran as a team so we had Matty Feldman represent the people that singled out the community. Incidentally it was the State Department that said that we were the not the typical but the model American community and this too was an incentive for me to move into the community as others. And Augie Hannibull represented, well he and Votee represented the old timers of the community, those really that developed and built this very beautiful town but were I guess disillusioned with the highhanded politics of the people that backed them. So I ran with Augie and with Votee and with Feldman, we were the ticked, “4, 9, 10”. We were a five man council. And that was the beginning of my political career. I ran second high that year. First time out. Augie was number one, and Matty was number in the vote getting in the community with a big field and some very talented people but fate was kind. I worked hard. A lot of cottage parties. Every night I was out speaking to the constituents, seeing the community and …

(I) What was your platform at that time?

(N) One was the college. I wanted to make sure that the college and the township would live in peace. The college was buying land east of River road. We had land west of River Road. People were shaken up hearing stories that a gymnasium may be built on their block. This actually is the streets running into River Road, just east of River Road. We had to quiet the fears. I developed a program which I worked out very successfully with Dr. Sammartino that the college could build their cathedrals to the sky of learning on the west side of River Road. We would give them exchange land. The land that Teaneck had on the west side for the land that the college owned on the east side of River Road and we lived happily ever after. Of course in a town that was well run such as Teaneck, there weren’t that many basic issues.  There was no corruption; there was no graft; they needed no night with shining armor, no white horse. But people felt that they were being excluded. It was the harsh treatment that they gave to Milt Votee. Through that I was able to get …

(I) When you say the harsh treatment that “they” gave. Who are the “they” that gave it?

(N) The Teaneck Taxpayers League.

(I) Who was the Teaneck Taxpayers League in those days?

(N) I guess former Mayor Brown was one. Jim Welsh the township manager was very much part of them although he never should have been part of them. There was John Freeney the township attorney. It was the old established people in the community, when I say old, not in years but lving here for many years.

(I) Long time residents.

(N) And also even though it was not, there were not as, well new people coming in may have meant new schools and you had the rising school population although we always separated the schools from, you know the Board of Education in Teaneck elections, they more or less controlled both sides. The election being in May nobody ran as a partisan. Although they did make overtures to me to be part of their group because my involvement in the community, they felt that Matty Feldman represents the new segment of the population that is coming into the community and let’s have him part of our team. But to say that there were, the issues more being receptive, being responsive. My campaign literature had all the clichés we see today. I can’t say that there was anything other than personality vs. personality.

(I) So it got you onto the council.

(N) Yes.

(I) And how did you get propelled into the Senate so quickly?

(N) Well then I became mayor. Augie Hanniball was top man, he traditionally became mayor. He was in office just a few months and passed away unfortunately. He was buried in Arlington National Cemetery and I was awe stricken. All of a sudden, this mantra of leadership was put on my shoulder and I had no desire, there was no drive that Matty Feldman would be the mayor of the community and I was very pleased and delighted after the first few months that I just took it as a duck took to water so to speak and

(I) Well who were some of your advisors in those early days?

(N) George Heftler. Stewart Brown. Henry Feistel. George Larsen, Frank Burr, they were the group that had worked very closely with me and township was a five, well there were no women on the council then, it was a five men council and then Jim Welsh was the manager and then when the new regime came in, he began to look elsewhere. Tommy costa was the fourth man and Brad Menkes, if you remember won by one vote on the absentee ballots. Then we had the …

(I) If Mr. Hannibull had died, how would they replace him. Do you recall?

(N) Well I remember Rudy Travers replaced him I remember. Rudy Travers was appointed to the next general election. Rudy Travers recommended a, he worked very closely with the Rockefeller family in the Rockefeller Center. He was either the general manager or an administrative assistant or aide to the Rockefellers, That’s Nelson, David and Lawrence and Rudy was just a class act. So here were, and I was then a registered Democrat in those years. There was a bone of contention with some of the Democrats that I should be a Democrat and I felt that because we had non-partisan government and although my tradition in politics, my votes in the days of Roosevelt whom I supported my first vote I guess and then Truman when I was in service, Roosevelt, Truman, I had voted mostly Democrats. I did support Republicans such as Cliff Case. When I moved into Teaneck I became friendly with Frank Cosmas who was a republican congressman and I wasn’t that partisan.

(I) So you were a registered Republican?

(N) No, I was an independent. I did not … who would vote more Democratic than He would vote Republican by instinct. I would vote with my heart, not with my head. If you voted with your head in Bergen County in those years, you would vote Republican. But I voted with my heart. And most of my votes, again, were Democratic although I did support Cliff Case and for a couple of elections I did support Fran Osmers until I became the campaign manager for Henry Helstoski and then we, that’s when I became a Democrat. Well I became a Democrat really running into state politics. As Mayor I welcomed John F. Kennedy into Teaneck. It was at the Teaneck Armory and I remember that day as if it were just yesterday. You could feel the electricity in the air. The armory was jammed to capacity. It was in that great Kennedy/Nixon complain. And then he came into the armory and there was that charisma that he had. I doubt very much when people talk about charisma and magnetism, he had it and we were just caught up in this great wave of enthusiasm. The pandemonium for this bright, handsome young New Englander that came into Teaneck. IT WAS just about a week or so before the election. And I welcomed John F. Kennedy as the mayor of Teaneck into Teaneck and we had a great day. Bob Meyner was there, he was the governor, and I am trying to think of, we had Lauren Bacall, we had Ted Bikel, we had great artists coming in and it was exciting and then I was coming to the end of my second term back in 1965 or 66, the Republicans Walter Jones paid me a visit. He and Frank Cosmas, they were the Republican leaders of Bergen County. In fact Walter Jones was a leader of the state. He was going to run for governor, came to my house for support. And I told Walter that as mayor of Teaneck and a non-partisan mayor I couldn’t endorse anyone running for public office, not even John F. Kennedy. But if he were to win the primary, perhaps I would get involved in Veterans for Jones. Well he did not win the primary so I didn’t have to fact that test. He lost the primary and Richard Hughes was the Democratic standard bearer and at that time, Republicans were working very hard trying to influence me to become a Republican and to run for office as a Republican up in Bergen County. And it was very tempting. If I were pragmatic about it, if I didn’t have a spark of liberalness in me, I would have succumbed because they were the power makers, they were, they wanted, I said you don’t want me, you want another Jack Javitz. I equated myself because of the changes in our population and they felt they couldn’t be left behind, they had to play catch up ball, they had to attract some Democrats with the name of Feldman or independents with the name of Feldman into the Republican party. And it was, they were great salespeople and they almost convinced me until I sat down with Richard Hughes and whom I admired and respected and I still do. Just a great, been a great governor for the state, a good education governor. And Richard Hughes said, Matty, what’s all this talk? If you run for office and we want you too. I don’t want you running on the opposite line from me. I am running for reelection. And I looked at him with his Irish eyes and I said, you’re right. I didn’t have the (hoofspa) to think that if I were to run as a Republican that I would do damage to his campaign because he was so loved by everybody but it would have hurt me very much to be on the ticket if I was running against Richard Hughes.

(I) Weren’t the other Democrats wooing you also?

(N) yes, so I then said to Danny Amster who was the Democratic county chairman that, who had spoken to me with the knowledge of Richard Hughes, I said, Danny, I am ready to go for the state senate. We are running at large. And If the party wants me, I am there. I’ve been bitten by the bug. I’ve been smitten by lady politics and that was my first, I ran statewide in 65 with the public announcement that I would complete my term as mayor and then not seek reelection if I am elected to the state senate. I think by saying that I must have received a lot Republican votes who wanted to run for the council and hoping Matty would get elected because he is a man of his word and I wouldn’t be surprised if the Tommy Costas and Sammy Bartolettas supported me to make room on the council to true to my work, I completed my term and just a year left or so, less than that, and gave all my energies to the state legislature.

(I) Before we get on to your activities in the senate, let’s go back to your, some of your local activities, the Teaneck part of history. What were some of the outstanding areas during your period of services on the council and the mayor?

(N) the most exhilarating and the momentous period of that tenure, of my tenure as mayor was the integration of our school system in the community. And they were the most, those days were the most exciting days of my political career. I’ll never forget them. In fact, I’ve enjoyed being Teaneck’s mayor more than, as much as I enjoy the state politics, this was my greatest experience. And that turning point in Teaneck’s history I was glad to be one of the many people that were so involved.

(I) Well, why don’t you elaborate on your particular role in this?

(N) My role, we always had a separation of I guess they would call it church and state but there was a separation of the Board of Education from Council in the community. Although I did support all the referenda for new schools, this was the crowning point of Teaneck was their school system. I never got involved in the Board of Education Politics per se, knew who I was going to support, I did support them as a member, as a citizen, not as a mayor of the community. But I saw the integration fight as a great moral issue and one of the things that I tried to accomplish as a mayor of Teaneck and I did accomplish it although it has fallen by the wayside as I read the papers today, we built a bridge between the Board of Education and the township council. The Board of Education was always the whipping boy for higher taxes. They were pointing a finger at the board members and, you’re taxes are going into education, that’s why your taxes are rising in the community. Hey, it is our school, it is our education, it is our kids. So I tried to build that up by having meetings with the board and the council to build up rapport and exchange of ideas.

(I) Well there was also a radio appeal that you made.

(N) The radio appeal that I made, well the integration fight was a moral issue and Harvey Scribner was right. There were children in our community that never saw a, white kid that never saw a black face until they went into the Teaneck High School and the blacks were only 3% of the population. Most of them lived in the northeast section of town. So when a young Teaneck youngster got into high school at the age of 13 or 14 of the first time in his life he saw a black face other than somebody on TV or the domestic that came to his home and in those years, you were stereotyped. And I felt it was unconscionable, it was unpardonable, we are living in a pluralistic society and we have to get to know each other at an early stage rather than in our adult and teenage years. So I took a role supportive without being out front for the integration of our community school system. And then there was a wise of demagoguery of people who were extremists, who even threatened violence on the first day of school. People would come to me and say they would throw their bodies in front of school buses if school buses were to pick up their children. They were to boycott the school system if we were to implement the busing program. See first we, as you know, elected a Board of Education that was sympathetic or had came up with a central sixth grade that believed in the integration of our school system. The first city in America to integrate by the ballot, not by a Supreme Court decision. Well I took to the airwaves the day before the election, I think it was WJRZ which was in Hackensack but we had the publicity in the paper beforehand that Senator Feldman was to speak to the people of Teaneck the day before school began. And I pleaded and I told them they had to do the right thing. We are a nation of law and the law came first. This was the law. Let’s not make our children a pawn in this political fight of integration. Let’s not leave any scars in the community and I made a pitch like I never made before and whether I cannot say in all, pardon my modesty, that it was my pitch but certainly it was the message that had a telling effect in some areas and with good newspaper support, it was very calm and the school integration got off to a very peaceful

(END OF TAPE 1, SIDE 1, - BEGIN SIDE 2)

(I) We were just talking about your radio speech.

(N) Twenty years later, well it was 21 years I guess now, I've, I want to reflect on my judgments and my actions and I find no cause for regret. Educational philosophies are dynamic, they are ever changing. It is not possible for any of us to know what would have happened if Teaneck had not integrated its public school system when it did. It is possible, of course, for us to speculate on the other course and I am satisfied for those of us who fought so hard for what we saw as justice and equity made the right decision. And I will conclude, June, with this observation. On the struggle that took place two decades ago, throughout my years in public office I have spoken frequently and passionately in support of public involvement in the process of government. I am convinced that our system cannot flourish without this participation. I cannot think a better example of how individuals united behind a common cause have the power to change the destiny of the community than the Teaneck integration struggle of the 1960s. The people of Teaneck made it possible.

(I) That certainly was a vital and electrifying period. What were some of the lesser things then that...

(N) Oh the Advisory Board on Community Relations. Not that I feel that it is lesser or is ... but I do feel that in those years I campaigned, you asked me what I campaigned on.  I campaigned on the establishment, on the establishment of an Advisory Board on Community Relations. I also campaigned on better street lighting and traffic safety. You asked me but this was more ... these are things that, we created the Advisory Board on Community Relations. Today that is what it is called. In those years, they called it the Mayor's Board of Community Relations because some of the other councilmen were afraid to touch it and they said it is going to go down to defeat, it is going to cause embarrassment and we will blame it on the mayor, Matty Feldman, rather than ourselves as the council so I appointed, it was called the Mayor's Advisory Board because it was difficult to get the entire council behind it and then it developed into the Advisory Board on Community Relations. And I remembered meeting after meeting, my concern, why did I create this? I wanted to stop the panic selling in our community. There were some real estate agents that were unscrupulous, pitting neighbor against neighbor, friend against friend, parent against children who lived in the same block or the same area. That the neighbors were going to turn over, blacks were moving into the community and this would mean the decline of your value of your homes. I tried to explain to people that we haven't got a wall around Teaneck. That there was a wall around West Berlin and East Berlin. We cannot prevent people from moving in but let's try to get people to know each other. Let's try to get them to respect their and when that neighbor moved into their block, if we were to run, where were we going to run to? We'd be running the rest of our lives if we are running away from something or from people. Let's stay where we are. Let's try to accept people for what they are. And we have to educate people. I was hoping through that Advisory Board on Community Relations we would get to understand people of different ethnic and cultural groups and therefore I called in all the clergymen and my greatest supporter was a Rev. Willenberg in the Teaneck Presbyterian Church. He was from Texas and he had a deep southern, deep Texas drawl. He says and I was raised in an atmosphere of that southwest where we had suspicions about our black and Indian neighbors and it was not Christian, it was not Judaic, it was wrong, it was not American. And he was really a wonderful, wonderful man, a great supporter as were others. There was Henry DeLawter, I am just trying to think of names, Father Henry and naturally Father Joel came in afterwards, Rabbi Washer, Rabbie Sigel when he first came to Teaneck prior to him Rabbi Trachtenberg, Rev. Van Ort. He was very bright. Unfortunately taken from our midst at a young age. Harold Van Ort of the Teaneck Community Church.  What great leaders they were, both Jewish and Christian, they were really great leaders and they just got behind Matty and spoke from their pulpits. I had meetings in the churches and we developed our Advisory Community Relations.

(N) But also the Christians and Jews were

(N) Yes. This was intra-Teaneck. Then we established in Teaneck a Bergen County council of Christians and Jews, a Bergen County Conference of Christians and Jews, and

(I) Was that something that you organized?

(N) Yes with Bill Caldwell of The Record, The Record columnist Dick Dickinson was our first chairman. Fairleigh Dickinson Jr. and I think the first Catholic nominee was Nevans McBride and then later John Breslin came along but we had, it was a unifying factor in Bergen County. The Bergen County chapter of the National Conference of Christians and Jews. And look at our own Holy Name Hospital. There's been a great change there.

(I) I recall some day-long seminars at Fairleigh Dickinson University on the National Conference.

(N) You've got a great memory June. You are going into the recesses of Matty's mind. Yes, that was sponsored by the National Conference of Christians and Jews. There was a Howard Devaney, a retired police officer that took upon himself a new career in life with the National Conference of Christians and Jews and he taught, he led seminars for police officers, law enforcement officers, when a new ethnic group, a new cultural group, a new racial group moves into the community, he was, you know they have to be accepted as fellow Americans. They shouldn't be harassed. We have to know something about this group and he led a seminar in community relations and we did encourage our law enforcement officers to attend the higher education, take courses in criminal justice and in community behavior so to speak. So Devaney was very instrumental in that. Courses were given at Fairleigh Dickinson University sponsored by the National Conference of Christians and Jews and I mentioned Holy Name Hospital just I guess a few minutes ago. They've come a long way from a hospital that was conceived by the order of the Sisters of Saint Joseph where all the staff were Irish Catholic and vet Holy Name in the true spirit of religion and of God of fatherhood and brotherhood has opened its doors. Now any professional person, any doctor with talent, whether he be Catholic or Jew, whether he be Irish or Italian or Polish, is welcome into that hospital. At one time it was difficult and a decision was made that either they become a community hospital and they made the decision or they become a hospital sponsored by a religious order just with only those of that religion serving on their board with privileges.    So with the growth and development of Teaneck, we also see the growth of this great

(I) The board of that hospital is now a multi-racial, multi­ ethnic board?

(N) Yes, right. The board, and I serve on the board, but the staff, the professional staff is pluralistic you know and this is, it is still run by the order of the Sisters of St. Joseph of Peace, great healing institution, but their board is a microcosm of Teaneck , their board is a microcosm of America and so is there professional staff of talented nurses, naturally nuns still serve as nurses but I am talking about the secular nurses as well as the men of medicine, the men and women of healing and of medicine so it is all part of this great township of ours.

(I) They have an extraordinary array of services now, they have a dialysis center, they have a Multiple Sclerosis Center

(N) It is an institution that we can be very well proud of within our community. See my theme in life as far as Matty is concerned is building bridges among people and I was raised in a home that really cared. My parents were both involved in the community life in Jersey City, in the educational life, in the charity life, institutions of Jersey City and I guess it fell upon my brothers and myself, I have two brothers very much involved in their community, although I am the only one to go into politics but my two brothers are involved in the community life and the communal life of South Jersey and of Essex County so I guess it is something that you do get from parents and you receive from home that nourishment, that direction to be of service. My philosophy is, life is not a dress rehearsal. You go around once, and that's it. So let’s try to help each other rather than hurt each other.

(I) In your years in the senate, you have been particularly in the Education Committee but you've served on so many committees. Would you elaborate a little bit on that?

(N) Well education has been, of course I presided over the senate for two years New Jersey has no, we do not elect a lieutenant governor so the senate president is second in command if the governor leaves the state, the senate president becomes the acting governor.

(I) What have you signed into law while you were an acting governor?

(N) That's a good question. I had the first solid waste management act in the 70s, I think it was 76 or 77, was an act that I helped author.  It was establishing mandating that every county in New Jersey have a solid waste district and if they don't, the state has to see to it that the state will come in and see to it that there is a solid waste management plan. Governor Byrne at that time being away said, Matty, this is your bill, you can sign this bill, enact it into law and I think it is the first time that a senate president as an acting governor signed a bill of his into law but Governor Byrne had a great sense of humor. When I first became acting governor, he was on a governor's trip and they called and said how are things going? I said great. I have taken a great burden off your shoulders. He says, what did you do? I said to him, Governor, I pardoned Hurricane Carter. He said, you can't do that. Hurricane Carter in those years he was a former boxer that was found guilty of murder and sentenced to I don't know how many years in jail and there were people that were very controversial, he was retried again sort of a like the Lindbergh case with a lot of controversy and the last thing that he wanted to do was to see him pardoned, you know, by some irresponsible senate president but we had a few laughs over that. I guess it was the higher education bill that to me was the most important bill. No matter what kindness fate may have for me in the future, this was a bill that established the Department of Higher Ed in New Jersey, this was a bill that made our normal schools, that's all they were, into a multi-purpose institution and this was the beginning of a new era of education in New Jersey when Richard Hughes was the governor and at that time I was assistant majority leader and I had chaired the senate education committee and did the many significant pieces of legislation after that but that was the beginning.

(I) Let's go back to Teaneck particularly. How about the whole Glenpointe controversy. Were you active in that?

(N) I was much to the unhappiness of a number of people. When I was mayor, I had conceived of an idea of building in the meadows and it would be sort of a, I hate to use the word luxury apartments but it would be of not what we would envision in some parts of the metropolitan area but in Teaneck where families would sell their homes, they would want to stay in Teaneck and there was no place to go other than Fort Lee or now Hackensack and I felt that an apartment, a high, we use the word high rise because it was in the hollow of the meadowlands as you drove along Teaneck Road all you would see was two or three stories above Teaneck Road so it was nothing that was obscene to the environment or to the eyesight. It was apartment middle income wage earners and above middle income wage earners and this created a great new cry in the community. It became a political issue. People were against it. They envisioned this beautiful Teaneck was to become another Bronx with apartments after apartments, and if three people tell me I am drunk, I am drunk and the public outcry was not only loud but I listened to the people and I said maybe I am ahead of my time and when there was that public cry of indignation about Teaneck becoming another New York with the proliferation, we are only talking about one apartment in that Meadowlands area so I dropped the idea. Now people have come to me and said Matty, we were against you then but we wished yesterday was with us because we are forced to go to Hackensack, we are forced to go to Fort Lee and we don't like to. There is no place in Teaneck where one can move today other than the town houses at Glenpointe and they are very lovely but people, many of them don't want to move from a home to another home. They'd rather move from a home to an apartment such as the Mediterranean in Fort Lee or Plaza or in Hackensack with the many fine apartments that we have there and so this was back in the 60s and after a few public hearings, I just withdrew my plan on this. Now we have Glenpointe. That was a political issue in town. I supported the people that bought the Glenpointe and that was an issue that again fear came into. You know, history repeats itself. In the integration fight there was fear implanted in the hearts and minds of people. When Glenpointe was first conceived by Mayor Burr, there was fear in the hearts of people that this was the beginning of the end. They would show, I remember during that campaign although I wasn't involved to that extent where I took the stump because I vowed, I've never been to a council meeting since I left. Since I left, I've never been to a council meeting. I know what's going on in town, I have recommended candidates for people to support but never have I contacted publically on any issue in the community because I am a former mayor and I don't want to be an active former mayor. I am like everybody else in the community. I am a participant in the elections in the community. I know who I am going to vote for but I am a spectator as to what goes on at the Town Hall.

(I) How about at the library?

(N) Well I was asked, yes. But just on the Glenpointe thing that I did not take the stump. I did support the philosophy of those that wanted Glenpointe and I was sorry to see that become an election issue because with the hurts of the past came alongside with the integration fight. If the first plan would have succeeded, people wouldn't today even be thinking about I hate to move to Fort Lee but I have to. I hate to cross that Hackensack into Hackensack no matter how lovely a town it is because I love Teaneck. My kids went to school in Teaneck. And so that's again it is history. And you mentioned the library.

(I) You mentioned your kids a moment ago. Did they settle around here in this area?

(N) Yes. One daughter, my oldest daughter Beth moved to Ridgewood and now has moved back to Englewood and she lived in Ridgewood for about ten years and now she is living in Englewood and enjoys Englewood and we enjoy having her very close by. I don't want my kids on the same block. It would be nice if they were in same community. Even that, you know, but I want them where I can somehow without traveling a few hours or hopping on a plane, see them. My other daughter Rachel lives in North Brunswick and both girls are active in the communities and my son lives in Springfield so everybody is in New Jersey. And I will tell you that makes me feel good June. Of course my son is just beginning a new career and he has a lovely bride and a little boy of his own and I hope that as time goes by he will be involved in his community when he has the time. My two girls are very much involved in their respective communities and that makes me feel good because sometimes as your children are growing up, you wonder are you spending enough time with them. And this is where Muriel has been great. I've always made it a point to have dinner with the kids even if I had a dinner to go to where I would have coffee or cake when I left the house but I did not turn my children off. You can meet people that are very sheltered and want to be spectators in life, not participants, because they felt they were neglected when they were kids by parents who were running all over the lot and neglected their kids. I feel good about this knowing that the sense of commitment that my parents gave me, my children now have that sense of commitment to their community and to the state and to the nation and to various community organizations that they belong to. And perhaps this never would have happened if I wasn't blessed with the type of wife that I've had over these forty years.

(I) She too has been active in

(N) Yes but somehow not turning off children. Muriel has done her bit in the community but never has assumed any leadership role. She has been there, she has responded, but she felt maybe in one household one was enough. Somebody ... and so the kids as far as their attitude towards community living are very positive so I didn’t turn them off which makes me fell good.

(I) Now let's go back to the library for a minute. There too you had some part in

(N) That was a very sad episode in my life. Well I was asked to head a drive to raise funds for a new library.

(I) Now let's just get the chronology straight? You were then a senator?

(N) Yes. No longer was I an officer in the community. A group of people wanted to expand our library and to me this was very exciting and as America is built by volunteerism, I wanted this new expansion to be by volunteerism, by getting contributions, by getting donations and in colonial days, they would call them barn raising periods where if a neighbor's barn burnt down, if one's barn burnt down, a neighbor would come and help and other neighbors would come and help and rebuild that barn. That's where one neighbor helped the other. And I felt what more novel purpose can there be than building an addition to a very fine library in our community. And I felt way we build it is with the contributions, pledges and we would show America how we did it ourselves without federal funds, without people being taxed to do it ourselves. And people, hundreds of people, contributed thousands and thousands of dollars to this project but unfortunately when you have faith and confidence in professionals that are helping you, it was a lesson. It was a lesson for me that I took the word of certain individuals of certain pledges that had been made, the bottom line, the X number of dollars that had been raised, and these are the people that have contributed and in one's own zealousness and enthusiasm, to see this thing built, there was some playing around with the truth. No one received not one penny put in anyone's pocket. No money was raised unless illicitly but the sums were fabricated, the amount that was raised, and of course if we were to raise X number of dollars there was to be some federal matching grants. But nothing that would do with the township or the treasury of the people of Teaneck. I still have faith in people but I would caution people before you cross the street, look cautious on both sides and look straight ahead and don't take people's word just because you have confidence when it comes to something like this. I've been involved in so many fund raisers in my life. I've never had the experience like this before. It was sleepless nights and it was aggravation. Good people were being (inaudible). Lovely people were in this quagmire. People look at them with questions, what kind of chicanery went on here? And yet when I first heard of it, I sensed that something wasn't right, I went right to the prosecutor's office and sat down with Ron (inaudible last name), the prosecutor. I said these are the facts, these are the figures. Do your own interrogation. Do your investigation. I, for one, as chairman of the drive feel nothing immoral was done, something maybe unconscionable was done to the members of the committee or the publicity that has gone out but nobody got ripped off on this thing and they made a very thorough investigation and gave everyone a very clean bill of health. And then they pulled out of it as Teaneck usually does. We have an addition, not what we had envisioned but again as again as part of Teaneck's history, some people wanted to make something political out of it. I don't know what they could have accomplished other than hurt good people in our community but there are always people that are mean and nasty and only want to inflict harm on other people. And I feel sorry for people who are inclined that way, to vent their spleen, their frustration on other people who are trying to do a good job in a community for the entire community. But right triumphed and so no mud is on anyone's (inaudible) as the poets say.

(END OP TAPE 1 - SIDE 2 - BEGIN TAPE 2)

(I) Matty, let's continue with some of your other local activities. Back in the early days of school integration, you were also involved in the Teaneck Political Assembly (T.P.A.) Would you care to elaborate on that?

(N) Yeah, the T.P.A. was a group of men and women who felt there should be a voice for the moderate, for the progressive forces in our community. They decided that no longer can we step aside or step backwards and not get concerned about the council as well as the board of education elections in the community. And it is refreshing, the T.P.A., but they were non-partisan. We had Republicans, we had Democrats, we had Independents all fused together for what we thought was the best interests of the community.

(I) Well how did you get going? What sparked the ...

(N) It had to be the schools. The schools was the catalyst that brought us together, that great fight, that moral victory in the, twenty years ago in the 60s, had such an impact on this community and then we were concerned too about a council that could turn the clock back in the community. I remember as mayor we discussed a municipal swimming pool owned by the town, not the private pool that we have today, and one of the councilman said publically that he's against the municipal swimming pool that he never took a bath with anyone in his life and he is not going to begin now. So to him, swimming was co-ed bathing. Another individual after he ...

(I) You wouldn't care to identify this particular councilman?

(N) That was the senior member of the council, the senior in age of the council. And we had some, there was another remark made by a Danessa Holland who was very much for the swimming pool and when the votes were taken and she noticed who voted against the pool, said to me within earshot of the councilmen, you see, he wants, he would go to bed with me but doesn't want to swim with me. This is the, it was tongue and cheek and he got the message. She was a very, very beautiful lady. But speaking about bathing, let me tell you an incident that happened and when I was county chairman, I had invited Ted Kennedy into the, into Teaneck to speak at a countywide meeting and his office said yes, he would be sure to be there. But they advised me that the senator, because of this plane accident in the middle west, he and Birch Bhy were involved, that he had to take a hot bath every morning and a hot bath every night and I said, no problem, no problem. So the date was confirmed. It was a Friday night in October and when I went home and I told Muriel that Ted Kennedy was coming in and because of his back injury, I would call the Schlussels who had a jacuzzi in their home and a sauna and I would speak to the Schlussels about Ted Kennedy bathing in their home and Muriel was very irate and said if he can eat in my house, he is going to bathe in my house. Then I picked up Ted Kennedy at the airport, Teterboro, and we kept the dinner quiet. I told him it is a Friday night dinner. The only ones who would be there would my family. In fact when George McGovern found out that Kennedy was coming in , he said I am the candidate, why not me? So he was invited to the rally. He was the presidential candidate but Ted Kennedy was to be the speaker. So on the way in from Teterboro, he said I hope I am not putting Mrs. Feldman out. I said you are not. It is Friday night, the family will be together and he said, we have a serving girl, we have a cook, and she is going to spend time with you. I said, oh yes, I have a surprise for you. And he said what? I said, Joan is going to be there. Joan Kennedy. And well there was no, he just like I told him it is three o'clock in the afternoon. No emotion. Then as we are driving to the home, just about crossed Ridgefield Park and coming into Teaneck, he says Matty, one favor please. I said, what? Before I meet the family, take me into the kitchen. I want, you have a serving girl, you have a cook, I want to meet them. I don't want to appear rude to the family but please, take me in the kitchen. I said, no problem. Well, it was a beautiful evening and as we drove up to the house, there were perhaps 200 people there waiting to see the Kennedy, Ted Kennedy, and we kept it quiet and I was very surprised at that number of people somehow word gets out of the grist mill and meanwhile, the day before he arrived, the Secret Service were checking the grounds, the trees, the bushes and the foliage because he is a very precious commodity so to speak , outstanding senator and there were hate letters coming in and assassination threats . Well as we approached the home and walked up the sidewalk, he said once again, Matty, the kitchen, the kitchen.  And there greeting him on the steps was Joan Kennedy and one of Joan's friends and then Muriel and my kids and he says, hiya Joan, he gives her a little kiss on the cheek as if he left the house at nine in the morning, it is now five in the afternoon, cause he didn't see her for a week. He was on some barnstorming tour of the midwest and he said, don't forget, the kitchen. Well I take him in the kitchen and I go over to the cook and I said, no, he walked over to the cook, extended his hand and said, my name is Ted Kennedy, what is yours? Oh she screamed, you know, and she was so excited seeing him. She was just all thumbs doing what she was doing. Then he left her and said to the serving girl who was taking H'ors douvres out, my name is Ted Kennedy and extended his hand and she almost dropped the tray and started to scream in delight, in delight that she saw a member of this great family. So after the bedlam in the kitchen quieted down, I said to him I understand that it is now bath time. He said, yes, my hot bath and I took him into the bathroom and he took his hot bath and believe me, the crowd just swelled outside in numbers. I could have bottled that bath water and sold it for a cure for holy water, for anything. That's how people were so excited at seeing Ted Kennedy. Then when he got out of the bath, he came down and says, I know that you're a traditionalist at heart. He says, where is my yarmulke? Ted Kennedy, he had the yarmulke and I made the invocation before the Sabbath and the Kiddish and he knew when to say Amen and then we had dinner and during the conversation, one of my daughters said, why aren't you running for President. I am a little disenchanted with George McGovern. So he said I will run when, I will never forget this, when Mother Rose tells me it is my time. I am the only Kennedy left. I've got to look after these kids. He said it is a problem since the assassination of my brother, President Kennedy, never called him John or Jack and of brother Bob, he said, I have to be with my family and it is not Chappaquiddick. I've been torn apart by the demise of my two brothers and Chappaquiddick is not the reason why I am not running for president. It is a loyalty to the family. I am the father. I have to play the role of the father and uncle and I will be there as long as they need me. And then he, you know they are so, they are beautiful people but politically I was, I thought I was politically wise but during dinner, he turned to me and said, you know Matty , we Kennedys will never forget the manner in which you introduced President Kennedy when he came to Teaneck in the 60s as candidate Kennedy. And then he continued and he quoted verbatim the introduction that I gave President Kennedy. It wasn't the greatest introduction in the world. There was nothing Shakespearian. It was nice, sweet, to the point. And I was proud of the introduction but never did I think that this would be recalled and I realized the efficiency of this family coming in from Illinois and Nebraska, he must have said, where are we going? Oh, we are going to Teaneck. Where is Teaneck? Oh, you are going to be at Matty Feldman who is the county Democratic chairman, who was the mayor when John F. Kennedy came into Teaneck when he ran for the presidential election and they had taken out an index card, apparently, and this is what Matty Feldman said when he introduced your brother. It was a great ego massage. But I am not that vain to think that that family remembered my introduction over the years but it showed you how they, politically, no one, no family, no individual is more attuned to what is right politically speaking than the Kennedys. We had a lovely dinner and then we went to Hackensack Courthouse. I believe the Arthur Lesemann was     congressional candidate and just before Arthur was to speak, the lights went out. And Arthur who looked like a Methodist minister during the Temperance Days thundered out because the lights went out but the loudspeaker was on. He says, what happened to the blankety blank blank lights? Put them on. And there was a hush because you looked at Arthur, he was angelic looking, a purist, you know, and he talked out of frustration. The language today would be quite acceptable but in those days, a congressional candidate to be human, and so we had a big laugh after that. The lights came on and Arthur presented Ted Kennedy because he wanted, he felt it was only right for him to present Ted Kennedy. We had a great evening. It was 15,000 people packed into that courthouse, that's the magic of a Kennedy. And George McGovern, naturally, was there and Henry Helstoski and Pete Williams. It was a momentous evening in the life of the Bergen County Democratic organization.

(I) There have been many other stories, maybe not quite as much fun as Ted Kennedy and his bath, but ...

(N) There was another one with ... the kids used to take me to show and tell, the World's Fair in New York

(I) The World's Fair in New York.

(N) Yeah. That was in the 60s. 64 or so. That's when the kids thought I was, there was a car outside the pavilion. It is a funny story. June, as mayor, many interesting things happen to one. Of course, I was involved. The kids used to take me to school for Show and Tell and every kid in Teaneck knew Matty Feldman. Now, when the World's Fair was in New York City, a family by the name of Gingold, Marty Gingold, attended the World's Fair and The Record had a little blurb about this incident and Marty was viewing one of the exhibits in the pavilion and his young son in those years, eight or nine years of age, left his father's side, came back a few minutes later and said, Daddy, there's a very beautiful car down the street. Do you know whose car that is? Well, that was a street that was manmade street with all the pavilions on both sides.  His father said, look, don't bother me. I'm busy here and 1ust stay in this building. A few minutes later, he came back to daddy. I just peered at that car again and it is just a beautiful car. I want to know whose car that is. Don't you know? You know everything. So Marty Gingold told his son, look, I don't know whose car it is. If you really want to know, go out there and find out but come right back. So his son leaves him, comes back a few minutes later. Now the father's curiosity is triggered and he said, well, did you find out whose car it is? He says, Daddy, that car was the most beautiful car I've ever seen. It has a chauffeur, the back of the car, the back seat there is a writing desk, there is a television set, the wood is just so beautiful. Daddy, you've never seen anything like this before. So Marty now is a little bit exasperated with his son and he said, so tell me, whose car is it? Well Daddy, I asked the chauffeur and the chauffeur told me the car belongs to Cardinal Feldman. Now actually it was Cardinal Spellman's car. It was the Vatican exhibit. But young Gingold doesn't know from Cardinal Spellman, he only knows from Feldman so I became a cardinal that day at the World's Fair in 1965 or 1964.

(I) To get to some of the more serious aspects in Teaneck, I know

(N) If you loose your sense of humor in political life or in life itself, forget about it. Yes, June.

(I) For instance, some of your other activities. I know you were active in U.N.

(N) Yes, in the early days of my administration , there was a movement, now I am disenchanted with the U.N. but I really feel it is man' s only chance of a peaceful world and I am unhappy with many of their equating racism with Zionism and attitudes with Afghanistan and the Soviet Union and the blocs but yet it is the only opportunity we have, mankind, for an enduring peace.  And in the beginning, there was quite a movement to get the U.S. out of the U.N. and we had a, I belonged in those years to United World Federalists. You had Rena Kamena and you had Martin Thurnauer very much involved with that great organization and then we had a group in Teaneck that wanted the township not to proclaim U.N. Day as we did. We had a big meeting at the Teaneck theater. But to proclaim U.S. Day and also for me to submit a resolution to get the U.S. out of the U.N. and the U.N. out of the U.S. Then I realized  outstanding American leaders such as President Eisenhower, General Eisenhower, spiritual leaders such as the late Pope, His Holiness, was much for United Federalists with the concept and I read quotes at a meeting, faced with this angry delegation, quotes from Dwight Eisenhower, quotes from His Holiness, quotes from other great spiritual leaders of American and of the world and this sort of quieted the waters because if they were to be upset with me or angry with me, they had to be angry with Dwight Eisenhower, they had to be angry with His Holiness,  they had to be angry with other great spiritual leaders in the United States and this too but it came, you know here you are mayor of the township and you are faced with international decisions and national decisions and this is one of the reasons, incidentally, we talk about the Teaneck Political Assembly that at least you had a group in the community that would face up to the darts and to the criticisms on certain fundamental issues that would be, the township would be confronted with.

(I) So that the resolution was not passed but the township celebrated U.N. Day.

(N) Yes, we had U.N. Day for many, many years and it really was festive. We've had dinners. We've had rallies. Again, the only hope for peace is through the U.N. but I was very frank. I was more enthusiastic about the U.N. then than I am now but t I am a supporter.

(I) But you have always been involved the patriotic aspects of town, the country, U.N. Day. Are you still chairing the patriotic observance …

(N) As a matter of fact, we are talking at this moment, this is Veterans Day and I just came from the annual township observance of Veterans Day which started as Armistice Day a number of years ago, 1954 became Veterans Day. Today, it is a very cloudy day, it is dismal, and yet we must have had 100     at the Municipal Building and in the Volcker Green today observing the Veterans Day. And this has been a, this town, we have this Patriotic Observance Advisory Board. I've been the chairman for a number of years. Bill Skinner is the secretary, prior to him was Bill Lindsey, Jr. and we are keeping alive the flames of patriotism, of national observance, of these holidays in the community because it saddens me, for example on Memorial Day, the malls are mobbed, people give very little thought to the sacrifices that have been made. But Teaneck, which is America microcosm, that flame still burns here on Memorial Day. It burns on the 4th of July. It burns on Veterans Day. And this committee is composed of all the Veteran groups in the community and I've had the privilege of chairing it for a number of years and with Bill Skinner at my side, we hope to continue for many years to come. The only problem that we've ever had was right after the Viet Nam War where on a Memorial Day Parade, a most unpopular war, and this created a lot of divisiveness in the community because those who were very fiercely against the war in Viet Nam wanted march with the veteran organizations carrying placards and banners and perhaps coffins depicting the havoc and the violence and the deaths in Viet Nam. Well they did march but they marched behind the Veterans contingent, not with Veteran contingent and we have Memorial Day services, we've never discontinued them, but we haven't had the parades for a number of years and perhaps the parades will come back again because it gives that small town flavor that we've all experienced growing up. We still want that to prevail. But Viet Nam, right now we are beginning to recognize those that went to Viet Nam, I am glad the federal government is doing it today, Teaneck has done it with a monument memorializing those from Teaneck that were killed in that action, in the Viet Nam conflict. But those days and that war tore apart America. There was quite a cleavage and a schism in Teaneck because we are America in microcosm.

(I) Did this parade business also spill over to the July 4th ceremonies?

(N) I think July 4th is festive. We had, we don't do it today, we had pony rides, we had the softball games, we had fireworks every 4th of July night on the banks of the Hackensack. They were costly the fireworks. Now we can see the great fireworks from New York City as we look to the east, to the Hudson, but it was very expensive but thousands of people would come to Teaneck, line the streets, the only community with fireworks. So therefore because of the safety, because of the hazards that would be created by crowds, we gradually phased out the fireworks. We still maintain the 4th of July with parades and bands and the floats. It is a great day in Teaneck.

(I) You said you've been chairman for a number of years. It has to be at least twenty years?

(N) Well since I left, since 1966 or 67 when, after serving as mayor for eight years and I still haven' t been to a council meeting since because I feel, you know, elected officials come, elected officials go, I am an observant to what is going on. I am an observer of what' s going on in the Teaneck but never want to, never went to a council meeting. However, I was asked by the council to chair the P.O.A.B. and I do it willingly and happily. I feel good. I felt spiritually refreshed after I left the Veterans observance today, their ceremonies. I do feel that way after Memorial Day and the 4th of July because that a little more festive. Though we made it a day, not as the shopping malls envision the day, we made it a day of observance and the participation in this community.

(I) Matty, in your senatorial efforts in Trenton, you've been with the Education Department for how long now, committee rather?

(N) I've been chairman of the Education Committee since 1977 so it is just about ...

(I) What impact has that, has your chairing of the Education Committee had on Teaneck's education for example?

(N) Well we introduced tough high school graduation standards today but there are people, it is not what Matty has done for education, it is what people of Teaneck have done for the enhancement and the advancement of education in our state. I was very honored to recommend two Teaneckers to serve on the state board of education. Naturally that is an appointment that is made by the governor with the advice of the senate with confirmation of the senate. And I recommended Dr. Bryant George a Presbyterian minister, who was at the Ford Foundation where he was in charge of all the charitable gifts that the Ford Foundation would make. He would sift through them and make recommendations to his board which gifts, what gifts should be given by the Ford Foundation. I, Bryant George was a wonderful ally of mine during the integration fight in the community, a leader in the black community of the United States. Marched with Martin Luther King, dear friend of Coretta King, very much part of the great Civil Rights Movement. Bryant George today is in the Far East working for the State Department. And I met him through Paula and Lou Rosenblum. That' s how I met Bryant George. I believe they were neighbors Marion and Bryant George. Well Bryant served on the state board of education , appointed by the governor with the advice and consent of the senate, served well, made a great contribution and then when he moved out of New Jersey to accept a position in Washington, I recommended Dr. Jones, Dr. Jim Jones, who is now vice chairman of the state board of education and I really Dr. Jones not only has the, his peers are so satisfied, I shouldn't use the word satisfied , but he has given so much leadership to the state board that they elevated him now to be vice chairman. He has made considerable contributions, immeasurable contributions to the education of all the children from New Jersey so Teaneck can be very happy and proud that two of its graduates so to speak of our public school fight have served and are serving on statewide levels. We've had people like Seymour Herr, trustee, Ramapo College, Gerry LeBoff, former chairman of the board of trustees of Montclair State College, both Gerry and Seymour have received honorary doctorates from the colleges that they served on the boards of.   Ramapo as well as Montclair State. So education-wise, this community of Teaneck, one out of 567, its citizens have an impact on the state of New Jersey. Leon Sokol has been counsel to the senate the last perhaps      twelve years which again is another accolade for a citizen of our community.

(END OF TAPE 2, SIDE 1, - BEGIN SIDE 2)

(I) We were just talking about the people in the town and education and one of the other things that actually came out of the fight for good integrated education in this town were the original blockbusting ordinances. Could you just tell a little bit about

(N) Well I was concerned in those years prior to the school integration. The early 60s. When we had people moving into Teaneck, blacks were moving into Teaneck, and after all, they are as entitled as any other group to find a better life and realtors seized upon this to pit neighbor against neighbor, friend against friend. For example, they would tell the Kapells, you better sell because the Feldmans have their home up for sale and they are going to sell to blacks then they would go to the Feldmans and say, the Kapells, you better move out, they have their home up for sale and they are going to have a black family move in so before you knew it, both homes were up for sale. A lot of panic selling followed in this community. These just crazy rumors without foundation frightening people and a group in the northeast, today we look at Teaneck where truly we use the word pluralistic throughout the community, every almost every block in the community who have a black face or Orientals there are Indians, there are, it is just a great, great community but in those early years, the black population was mostly in the northeast and a group of residents headed by Kay Schick and Ed Schick and the Colligans, Bea and Brian Colligan and others, names escape me at this time, but it is all part of history and Reg Damerell book , TRIUMPH  IN A WHITE  SUBURB, formed a Teaneck Civic Conference and this is a group that said we will stand our ground , we are not going to be frightened or coerced into moving from our homes; we are not going to be part of the panic selling that has prevailed in some areas of the community. And they would put signs outside their homes, THIS HOUSE NOT FOR SALE - THIS HOUSE NOT FOR SALE. And national magazines picked it up. I believe it was not the COSMOPOLITAN of today but the COSMOPOLITAN of the 60s had a human interest story about MY HOME IS NOT FOR SALE. Then the council forbid the realtors names going on signs outside their homes.

(I) Were you on the council at this time?

(N) I was on the council then. We would, because somebody drives to Teaneck and they see lawns dotted with like Route 4 when you leave Teaneck, with signs advertising realtors. A real panic selling fever hit the community and then that was refined to where you could put your own telephone number or your agent's telephone number. Now the courts have ruled and you find realtors names outside of homes today but you don't see panic selling today. Teaneck is a community other people want to move into not want to leave. But in those years, there was the wave of panic selling because of prejudice, because of suspicions, but thank God that things have subsided.

(I) The so-called blockbusting ordinance canvasing and things of that sort?

(N) Well today even if a realtor would engage in these sort of tactics today, they would be reported to the Real Estate Commission, it would result in a penalty for that realtor by the commission.

(I) Well I think we have covered the bare highlights of your time and activities in Teaneck. I wish we had a great deal more time but you are a very busy person so I am going to say thank you for all that you have given to us for the Oral History Project.

(N) You're welcome.

(END  OF  TAPE)


 

(END OF TAPE)

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